sherman51

if you continue to use the vro. you want to get the gas oil mixture out. otherwise your not going to be getting enough oil mixed with your gas. could really cause some major problems. and like others i have heard bad things about the vro,s. sounds like they are just a blown engine waiting to happen. pre mixing is not really that much trouble.

sherman

i,ve never had a boat untill now that had the external reservoir. but i could see the air going out that way. because as far as i can tell the fluid free flows up to the reservoir. so there shouldnt be anything to stop the air from going out that way. you could get a plug and take the line loose from your outdrive and put the plug back in the hole, just untill you tested the lower unit.

sherman

yes, it seems the guys on here are real sportsmen. we have all been able to post our thoughts without anyone getting slammed. this is really turning out to be a good thread.

and as for leaving all rods out even after we get our limit, there is really nothing that says we cant keep fishing for other spiecies or even catch and release. but it is fudgeing just alittle bit to let others use these rods to catch there limits. but myself, i see nothing wrong with this pratice. i think when trolling you should be able to use as many rods as you can handle, and not be limited to 2 or 3 rods per person. we all know that 1 person with 2 rods may not catch anything. but put out 6 or 8 rods and theres going to be a couple of those thats going to catch most of the fish. i,ve even used the same bait on all rods, but it always seems 1 or 2 of those baits catch most of the fish.

alot of states allow party hunting in some form. deer drives and even tagging deer someone elce has shot. and some states allow baiting. so i believe if something is made legal it is a more accepted pratice. here in indiana it is not legal to party hunt or to bait deer. but i accept it in the states where it has been made legal. just like using crossbows has not been legal here untill just a few years ago, they made it legal in the last part of archery season. and its my understanding that starting next year its going to be legal the intire season. to me its just another tool for hunters to use. and it might just get more young people into the sport of hunting. but for some its still not accepted.

for me the biggest reason i hunt anymore is just to spend some time with my sons and grandkids doing something together. just like fishing, the only time they really go fishing together is when we go to erie. so i will do that as long as im able. so i wouldnt want somebody elce to kill my deer, but i see nothing wrong with it for the person that wants the meat more than the hunt. and i have let the little ones reel in my fish. i get just as much enjoyment watching them catch fish as reeling them in myself. i have caught tons of salmon and steelhead over the last 35 yrs. so if its my turn to catch a walleye and it turns out to be a big steelie i,ll hand it off every time. my grandkids or daughter n laws havent caught many of them. so its more fun to me to just watch. i wish the best to all who love to fish and hunt.

sherman

Back in the day of 3 king limits you almost had to party fish. If I had landed three kings and it was my turn on a fish, was I supposed to hand it off if it made a run? Or if I had three kings and the guy fighting a fish didn't, and it started jumping, should he hand it to me as it's a steelie?

On a boat we just go communal. Some days my kids reel in all the fish.

you bring up some good points. and this is why i started this thread was to get more thoughts on things. i,ve fished a few charters and never seen them pull rods. and i never have either. but that dont mean we shouldnt. just makes you think. dont it?? i,ve never heard of the dnr ever ticketing anybody. maby its just an accepted pratice. and i,ll probably keep doing it untill i get caught.

i have done the same things with the kids. sometimes its just more fun to watch them bring in the fish than to catch them myself. now on my boat when fishing the central basin for eyes, i,ll never reel in a steelhead. i will always hand it off the the ones that hasnt fished alot. my grandkids and daughter n laws fish with me now. i love to watch them bring in a big steelie.

i dont think i really see anything wrong with taking a deer for someone in your hunting party as long as they are out there hunting with you, and it was lagal to do so. but i wouldnt want somebody taking a deer for me. the hunt is more important to me than getting a deer.

sherman

i want to thank all of you that has posted on this. i know its a tough subject. but nobody has got personal. that just keeps it a good clean thread where we can share our thoughts.

and i think i am like most others on here, i just like the hunting and not so much the killing. so i want to hunt right up to the last minute. or shoot my own deer. and if i dont get one, i just eat license stew,LOL. now i do no a couple of guys that will take there deer any way they can get it. we dont hunt with them anymore. we did have one guy that hunted with us, and always on the last day he would ask. if he had the shot did anybody want him to. we all just told him no. he would say if we had a shot to take it. but none of us ever did. the only reason i hunted with him, was he was my brother n law, and a good guy to be with. he would give you the shirt off his back. but he is gone now. maby where he,s at now he can get as many as he wants,LOL.

im not sure what i would do if they made it legal to shoot a deer for someone in your hunting party. and someone wanted me to shoot one for them. i believe i would atleast think about it on the last day of the season.(and it was legal). but myself, i wouldnt even think about someone elce taking my deer. that moment is what you,ve been waiting so long for.

as for pulling rods. for the most part we dont have that problem very often. but i guess we leave all rods out, so the guys thats got there limits can catch and release untill everybody elce gets theres,LOL. but they have to wait there turns. we dont assign rods to people. we just take turns no matter which rod catches the fish. im sure if you have done much fishing, you,ve found that one rod might catch half of our fish.

thanks again guys for your clean comments. i wish you all good hunting.

sherman

ive been reading alot about this subject on another forum. i thought i would just get some of your thoughts on this. and if you have a problem with one type party hunting and not another one, please say what you think.

there is the hunting where one guy buys tags for his uncle bill and aunt mary and his grandma. and then goes out and fills these tags for himself, and the people never go in the woods to hunt.

then there is the 2 or 3 guys that hunts together and they all hunt hard. one guy gets a shot at another deer after taking his. he calls one of his friends and they tag the deer.

then there is a large group of hunters, and part of them take up a stand and the rest make a deer drive. the hunters on stand just shoot everything that comes by, untill everybody fills there tags.

im sure there are other ways to party hunt, but these are the ones i,ve been reading about.

party hunting in indiana is not leagle. and me or the guys i hunt with dont party hunt. i wouldnt want somebody to shoot my deer even if it was legal. but i could understand how if it was legal some would take the deer if they were hunting together and maby be the last couple of days of the season.

another question in the mix. if 6 guys are fishing with 12 rods and 3 guys has there limit. do you leave 12 rods in the water until all the limits are filled, or do you take 2 rods out every time someone gets his limit??

i really hope this doesnt turn into a pi$$ing match. i just wanted to get alittle discussion going on this subject. but im sure if it gets out of hand this thread will get closed.

sherman

years ago i used a 3 hp on an old 16 ft fiberglass. it worked great on any water that i would fish. if it was to rough for that motor we just didnt fish.

sherman

i would say that a 20" shaft would work ok for trolling with your kicker. it would even get you back to shore if your big motor was to quit on you. but your not going to get the best performance out of it. but it will work. if you already have the motor with a 20" shaft i would try it out and just see how it worked. i dont think the 3" is going to hurt you that much.

if it doesnt work have you thought about getting a kicker motor bracket. i have used them in the past and they work good. that way you just put the mount where your motor is set where you want it in the down position. then when your not using your motor it just lifts up out of the way.

i still have the last one i used. it is a good one, made out of aluminum and the plate the motor clamps on is some kind of composit. it is spring loaded to help lift the motor up. it is rated for up to a 20 hp i believe. its still in great shape. and i even have a quick mount plate that makes it real easy to remove the motor if your going out to play. then it just leaves the small slide mount on the boat. i would let you have the whole thing for 85.00 shipped to your door.

if you buy the bracket, i also have one of the self adjusting steering rods thats made for mercruiser to outboard. you might be able to modify it to work on outboard to outboard. i,ll send it along for another 50.00. i really dont care if i sell it or not. but it is just sitting out there in my pole barn. and if it might help you out then i would sell it. if not i may still use it again sometime in the future. i thought it just might be another option for you. but if you already have the motor, i would try it just like it is before i did anything.

my old boat is a 21 ft cobia with a 350 vortec with a double pumper holley 4 barrel. and if i was to use it again, im thinking about going back to a kicker motor, because of gas prices. i just use the easy troller trolling plate on it now. the boat im using right now is a 28 ft sea ray with twin outdrives. so i really dont have anyplace to mount a kicker on it. and it trolls slow enough for me with one motor running. but i,ve had alot of problems out of it, and its a job to tow it all the way to erie. so i,ve been kinda thinking about getting it all lined out and selling it. (but then after i get it fixed i probably wont want to sell it,LOL.) but if i do sell it i will start using the 21 fter again. but i just really dont think thats going to happen.

good luck with whatever you do.

sherman

hey brandon

yes, i have measured them many times over the years. and the best measurement that i have been able to get is 20". i have an old inline 6 cylender 115 hp on my tri hull, and i measured it before i put it on my boat. the cavitation plate is a few inches back from the transom, so i just eyeballed it. i measured down from where it sits on the transom to as close as i could get to be even with the top of the cavitation plate, and it was 20". now i might have been off a 1/2" or something, but nothing major.

now the last outboard i had was on a 19 ft center console. and it had a 25" on it. you just dont want to use a 25" on a 20" transom or a 20" on a 25" transome. you just wouldnt get max performance out of your motor.

i have bought a few old boats over the years. and bought a few motors, and have measured them to make sure i had the right length shaft for the boat i had. i would have put this 115 merc on the center console boat i had after i blew the 150 hp that was on it. but it had a 25" transom. so i sold the center console and put the 115 on the tri hull i have now.

now you can put a jack plate on your boat and adjust the motor up or down to get the best performance out of your motor.

sherman

mine is 20" which is concidered the long shaft. but they make a 25" which is the extra long shaft. and i think the short shaft is 15", but im not just sure about that length. but the 20" is the most common, because there is just alot more boats with the 20" transoms in this part of the country anyway. hope this helps.

sherman

i used them many years ago. but for me there just not worth all the hassle. if i was only going to run all riggers then i probably would stack. but since i,ve learned to use divers i just dont stack anymore. you can use the lite bite slide divers with the big ring and the 4 oz weight and get pretty deep.

sherman

Downrigger rod length and actions are very much dependent on the individual boats setups. 7' one piece rigger rods are most common around Lake Michigan boat docks. It is mainly due to the fact that most salmon boats run lots of lines. Shorter rods are easier to get other rods over and around at the back of the boat. That also means that the lines point of entry into the water is closer to the back of the boat, again, the angler is more able to fight a fish around the rigger rods lines easier than if it were farther away from the transom. Shorter rods also have more power when compared to a longer rod of equal spine.

Longer downrigger rods, even as long as 9' are also common to a lesser extent. Longer rods distribute load and shock more evenly. Longer rods are more forgiving for less experienced anglers due to having less power, resulting in fewer lost fish due to overpowering.

Choose a rod length and power that suits your own fishing style and boat layout. There are no right or wrong answers for the most part, just what works for you.

Speaking of downriggers, I stopped in at the Traxstech shop today to pick up a few things for customers. The old Vector downriggers have gotten a complete makeover. Complete billet construction, large beefy motor capable of pulling 24# rigger weights at light speed, and an autostop system that is by far the most impressive thing I have seen in rigger technology. This thing is smart, fast, and most important, easy to operate. If you have ever seen the quality construction of Traxstech equipment, you can imagine what they have done with the new riggers. Not sure when they will be available, but at the very latest, they will be at the winter/spring shows in full force. There will definetly be a pair on my new boat for 2012, and I work for the company that owns Cannon!

Sorry about the infomercial, I just was very impressed and thats not easy as anyone that knows me can attest to.

i think that was great info on the rods. now it really does make sence why so many guys like different length rods. and the shorter rods are alot better about getting around your other gear. and maby why i prefer alittle longer rod myself. i think i do get more fish in the boat with the longer softer rods.

great info on the riggers for anyone thinking about getting new ones.

sherman

thanks guys i had read on a other post that recommened 7ft dr rods,think i'll look for a couple shakespare dr rods to start of with.can you use dipsys on these rods?

just my opinion again. but any of the rods thats talked about here can be used for divers. i dont even have matching rods for my divers. and i started running 8 of them this year. the only time i really had any problems was when i would get a white perch or white bass, then i sometimes got tangled in another line. but i use an 8 ft med/lite for my back rod then a 8'6" for the next then a 9' for the next then a 10 ft for my front rod. all of them are med/lite except the 10 ft and its a med. and these are all just lower priced glass rods. i think glass is just better than other rods for riggers or divers. but running this many divers i like to spread the tips out just alittle. and i run the back rod tip lowest then alittle higher on the next rod and alittle higher on the next. just helps prevent tangles. i run the back diver on a 1 setting # 2 rod on a 2.5 setting out an extra 20 ft. rod #3 rod on 4 setting out another extra 20 ft #4 on a 5.5 setting out another 20 ft extra. this just keeps them apart. if your only running 2 or 4 divers you can use just about any rod that will stand up to salmon fishing. i dont like to go to light tho, and i dont like broom sticks. so any good med or med/lite downrigger or diver rod is good. and like i said this is only one opinion. you should get more before you decide.

sherman

i see most guys like med action rods, and they are a good choice. i personally like med/light action. a deacent med/light has always worked good for me. i do like alittle longer rod than 7', i like 8' or 8'6". just another opinion

sherman

Good choice on the riggers. Keep an eye on ebay over the winter for the ball cradles and swivel bases, there are some good deals to be had. Good luck.

i have to agree with him on this one. i,ve bought alot of stuff from ebay. as a matter of fact the 1st set of the pro tournaments i got this year was off ebay. there was 2 places running auctions on them with no reserve. huntingandfishingusa and lordoftheriggers, (you can contact either one of them for better info.) they didnt have any of the extras, they was stripped down models. but i already had the rod holders and swivel bases i got off ebay for my sportsmans last year. so all i needed was the riggers. got the pair for 525.00 and 25 shipping. you can run across some good buys. just make sure you dont pay more than you can get it from lord of the riggers. and he does sell some used stuff also. double rod holders, swivel bases and such. i do want you to know that i dont really know the guy at lord of the riggers. i just know he has treated me right. i dont even remember his name right now. but i think its tony, he is a good guy. and you get his best prices by sending him an email to the address i gave you.

sherman

if you had said something i would have tried to help. i sent a email to [email protected] and got 2 big jon pro tournaments with the clamp on rod holders and swivel bases and auto stops for 659.00 including shipping

sorry but i just noticed i hit the wrong number, it was 759.00 and not 659.00. but i thought that was still a good buy. and i dont know if you knew it but the pro,s has a bigger motor than the sportsmans or the capt packs. they will lift my 13 lb weights at 200 ft per min.

but you,ll be very happy with yours, and you did get a pretty good price on them. and remember if you get the auto stops or any other big jon stuff check with [email protected] before you buy.

sherman

if you had said something i would have tried to help. i sent a email to [email protected] and got 2 big jon pro tournaments with the clamp on rod holders and swivel bases and auto stops for 659.00 including shipping

is that the one that has the shear pins?? if it is it was sold by cabelas. im not just sure who made them for cabelas, but that was the only place i know that sold them. but they had alot of problems with them, and i dont think they sell them anymore. but i see alot of them on ebay. i have used them myself, but just sheared way to many pins. so i went to the easy troller. they are so much better. and the bottom of the plate is spring loaded. so if you forget to raise the plate it will swing up and not bend the plate like the old happy trollers. cabelas still sells the shear pins but they dont have the plates on there web site anymore. i know this doesnt really help you much, but its all the info i have.

sherman

I think I am going to go with the Walker Kokanee Electrics. They have 3 foot booms, auto stops, and positive ion, and swivel mounts. For 384 each I didnt think that was bad. I am only going to run 2 off the sides towards the back of boat. Wish i could run them straight off the rear, but I have a seat that folds down into a casting platform that would get in the way.

I found some used cannon 10 mags with 42 inch booms on ebay that I also liked, but they don't have the auto shut off. You guys seem to think the auto shut offs are the way to go to save time and gear.

Thanks for the help,

Brandon

i personaly think you made a great decision. walker makes a fine rigger. and if you find the booms are alittle long for rigging you can always add the auto ball retrievers. and yes on the auto stops. once you use them you,ll see why they are the way to go.

sherman

hey

i hope you got the info you was looking for. have you made any decisions on your riggers yet?? all the top brands are good riggers. with the long booms the walkers are a reel good choice, because you can get them with auto stop and the auto ball retrievers. i really like those auto ball retrievers. i think the new cannon mag 10,s come with the auto stop. and some scotty,s come with extendable booms and auto stops. now for the money i think the big jon,s with auto stops are a good choice, and i really like the way the booms flex on the big jon,s. puts alot less stress on your boat. and doesnt jerk your weights so bad in rough water. but they are all good riggers. just what you like the best, and what you can afford. i was using the big jon sportsmans with the 2 ft booms they were good riggers. i bought the auto stops to go on them but never got them on before i sold them. but you can add a 1 ft section of boom to the newer sportsman models. but i bought a new to me boat with twin outdrives and wanted to go with 4 riggers. so i bought 4 new pro tournaments with auto stops and 4 ft booms. i used them this year and just loved them. its really nice to just hit the up button and forget the rigger while you fight your fish. let us know what you decide.

sherman

i guess im one of the guilty, i didnt have any idea caps was yelling. even tho i usely just use lower case letters anyway. it wasnt because i didnt want to yell. but i do use caps when i want to make a point or get someones attension. like when i put, LOL. i always use caps. but i do good just to be able to post at all. i just never had any reason to use the computer much. just for searching things up on line, and surfing ebay. i just started the forum thing and really enjoy it, and i dont do anything just to try and pi$$ anybody off. so if there is anything elce im doing that shouldnt be done, its not because i want to be rude, its that i really dont know. my computer skills are just one finger and hunt and peck. and im sure there is alot of us out there that dont know all these things. i just asked my wife if she knew this, and she did, but she has been on computers alot longer than i have.

myself i never paid any attension to what type letters was being used. i always was more concerned with the content of the post. so if your telling me a better way to catch fish or where to catch them i really dont care how you post it. just be good enough to post it. or you can just pm me the info and yell at the top of your letters,LOL.

i do some emails to family and friends and have used caps, and oversized, and colored, and custom lettering just playing around. just because i found out i could do those things,LOL.. and that was all good i guess, because none of them said anything.

i have found its better for me if someone uses caps or oversized letters. makes it eaiser for me to read them. but if it is understood by most that caps is yelling i can understand it bothering some.

it was nice of you to inform us of this, even tho it doesnt bother you or me. its still nice to know. and this old dog is always wanting to learn. it kinda like using punctuation marks and spelling. it seems to offend some when this happens. but there is a few of us that just does the best we can. my step dad tried to kill my mom when i was just a kid. he busted her skull and one of her arms where he beat her with a 22 rifle. so she was laid up for a long time and had 7 kids to raise. so i quit going to school and went to work to help her. i did go 2 weeks in the 6th grade. and got my ged while serving in the marine corps, working on jet aircraft. and even took some classes at ivy tech. i was going to ivy tech for photography, but i had to take a math class and a psychology class. but it didnt help my spelling or my punctuation marks. so i still just do the best i can and if you,ll look over my spelling and punctuation marks, i,ll do my best not to yell to LOUD,LOL. i,m 60 now and have made it just fine. i did have to always work for a living except for a short time i took a supervisors job at the factory where i use to work, untill i got sick and had to quit working. so theres just not much i can do about those things. but i can remember to not yell on here. that is ofcourse unless that is my intent,LOL. and i am sorry for such a long post. now go catch some big fish.

sherman

i like running the short booms if im only going to run 2 riggers. that way you dont really need to use ball retrievers. if your going to run them off the back just make sure there long enough to clear everything. when i run 2 riggers on mine i run them off the sides and used swivel bases then turned them back at a 45 degree angle. that way i could clear my diver rods and still leave the back open for landing fish. if you think you might ever need longer booms you might think about big jons with the long booms and just save the extra sections of boom. and the pro tournaments come with the auto stops. i got new ones this year and love the auto stops. just another opinion.

sherman

you can check out the big jon riggers at lordoftheriggers.com

welcome ron. this is a great place to get started on lake michigan. there is some really helpful people on here that are more than willing to share there fishing expertese. all you have to do is ask. and your comments are always welcome, most of the time you wont get slammed on here even when some dont agree with you,LOL.

pm already sent.

sherman

i would say its still good, but i would test it out real good. i have some ande 20 lb test that i stored in my closet. its stll good, and its been there for 8 or 10 yrs. this may not be the norm, but it worked good for me.

sherman

That's what I was trying to say without actually saying it. Not saying fluorocarbon in general is bad. I've had really good luck with Seaguar, and you can get it in bigger spools to save some money.

seaguar is also what i like to use. i tried vanish for awhile because it was cheaper to use. but i just didnt like it as well as seaguar leader. i had some brake offs that i didnt think should have broke with the vanish line. no problems at all with seaguar. good fishing to all, floro or knot,LOL.

sherman