SeaCatMich

Grand Trunk is the one I have used the last 3 years or so when I go to Muskegon. I just wish that it had fish cleaning. I know that Fisherman's Landing has fish cleaning but it is an awful long run all the way down the lake to get to the breakwall.channel.

The area we used to jig in was in the shadow of the big stacks of the power plant. It was 20' to 40' deep or so and the salmon came through in schools before heading up the river. It was quite the sight back then with people fishing all through the night. Lanterns in boats and bonfires at Fisherman's Lading and an amazing number of salmon caught.... but that was way back when Springs Tackle was open.

What is the Snug Harbor ramp out by the State Park? Is it a good ramp for bigger boats? Is there a fish cleaning station?

Not so much interested for fishing the inland lake but it appears to be the closest one to the channel for summer use.

I see some reports of fish getting dark out in the big lake and seeing that some Kings were caught in Pere Marquette lake a couple weeks ago when I was up there. How about Muskegon Lake? Has anyone been trying or seen anyone trying with success off the power plant by the mouth of the river?

That was where I hooked (not landed ) my first King many, many years ago. Thought it might be fun to go give it a try again this coming week but if the fish are still mostly in the big lake, a couple weeks later might be a better idea.

Related question... Looks like Fisherman's Landing is probably the best ramp as far as proximity to the mouth of the river. I have launched there in the past with much smaller boats than I have now. The cat is 21' but because the trailer bunks sit high it is probably closer to a 24'+ V hull for launching. Are the ramps at Fisherman's Landing long and deep enough for me? I have launched at the ramp out near the high-speed ferry and it is okay.

Another Fisherman's Landing question... Is this a city launch or a DNR launch (where my DNR Passport tag would work)?

I had a slip at Crosswinds in Ludington for most of the '90s. Would drive up from the Lansing area two out of every three weekends. The Badger is neat to see come in/out and is a classic part of the city's heritage. What I really hated was having to clean the coal dust off my boat every week. Since it is a very fine carbon it stains stuff like fiberglass when stepped on and can be a real pain to get out of the nooks and crannies of a boat. When my parents retired they bought a place a mile or so north of town on Lakeshore Drive since Dad spent a lot of time up there fishing with me. The dust got all over the house and the cars too. Many of the locals hate it... but most don't say anything because it isn't "politically correct" to say anything bad about the ferry since it is perceived to be a big tourist draw and indirectly a big part of the local economy.

The airborne coal soot is bad enough. Dumping 4 tons of coal ash into Lake Michgan per day (1 ton per trip, 4 trips per day) is hidden from most people but is no longer an acceptable action. I'm not a big fan of lots of the convoluted regulation that the EPA is now putting forth but this practice is really outdated and needs to be stopped. Maybe 50 or 75 years ago this would have been "okay" but not in 2012. LMC needs to either modernize their operation or shut it down. There is a good reason that it is the last coal fired ship on the Great Lakes... it is obsolete!

I know that their major concern is the overall cost of updating and the subsequent increase in fare rates will make it non viable. Well the current rates are not exactly cheap and I really doubt that it is used as a frequent method for anyone to travel between Michigan and Wisconsin. It is a tourist novelty. If you want to get across the lake efficiently the newer ferry that goes between Muskegon and Milwaukee is faster and more conveniently located for many.

They have had 5 years plus to find a solution and it does not seem that they have used the time wisely or effectively. Time is up!

Wow, now I'm glad that my crew had family issues and bailed on me for fishing this past weekend. I seriously considered heading over to Holland to do a solo trip but decided that a holiday Monday was probably not a good time for solo launch & retrieve and it sounds like I was right. I may have to go buy a lotto ticket but my good luck has probably worn off.

My downrigger stretch is usually a lot like Ben's. If I'm getting lots of hits on the divers but the riggers are quiet, then I will shorten up to 15' or so.

Here is a map of the LAT/LON of the buoy off the UGLOS site:

I don't remember a limit on them back then. But most didn't abuse the resource either. They caught for the table, and that was enough. I remeber back in early 90's when I moved to Bay City, they made it 100 inland, and still no limit on the bay. Then a few more years it went to 50 and 100, then 50 everywhere that I remember. Then 35 on Lake Mich. Too many changes to remember correctly.

Pretty sure the Sag Bay daily limit back in the '70s was 100 but that was a long time ago. Being 2 hours away we didn't get to go very often so we caught what we could and had many meals. Still my Mom's favorite fish to eat although walleye is a close second.

Back in early July we did very well with a nice 3 man limit of Kings and Steelhead out of Muskegon, but spent the whole day dodging nets. That really makes me a nervous wreck and is is not fun fishing at all. Consequently we have never gone back. I like to get out pretty early and it is hard enough to see the flags/staffs in daylight let along dark/dawn conditions.

Dan Keating's videos are also excellent for learning quickly about catching salmon: http://bluehorizonsportfishing.net/books-and-dvds.html?99442fec65e0565b58159c3121c2ed84=20917769a7b6f74a42ad0a15b89f6335

Lots of varied opinion on your questions! If there were cut and dry answers, it would be called catch'n and not fish'n. Plus what works today won't tomorrow. That's what makes if fun.

• What speed do you aim for at the ball?
  Down-speed varies depending on the unit you have. With a DepthRaider my target was 2.2-2.3 most of the time, but with my X4 most hits this year have been at 2.5 to 2.7. Have also caught fish as slow as 1.8 mph and as fast as 3.2.
  
• How far behind do you run your spoons and plugs from the ball?
  I generally use the 100 "rule". 100 minus depth = set back... so at 20' down, 80' back; at 70' down, 30' back. However I rarely go shorter than 20-30' back anymore except when trying for Coho in the spring where I'll run some spoons 5-10' off the ball right in the prop wash
  
• What temperature range do you shoot for?
  42* deep near bottom; 46-49* suspended, but anything below 52 if it is otherwise warm -- If there are fish consistently on the graph at a certain depth range, I'll put a lure or two up there too even if it is out of temp
  
• How high above and below do you fish the temperature break?
  Generally up to 10' above and if I see fish lower will go there too. If fish are showing consistently at a depth, I generally try to fish a feet above them as generally salmon/trout feed looking up.
  
• How long are your dipsy leaders?
  8'-10' for spoons and plugs if the rod is long enough (remember you still have to be able to get the fish close enough to net); 5' for flasher/fly, flasher/cutbait (plus the flasher and fly/cutbait)
  
• How do you calculate how far down a dipsy is? For example 150 back dialed on 3?
  I use the Precision Trolling book but only as a general guide. Have got 10 hits this year while adjusting divers -- letting them out slowly to get more depth.
  
• How long are your fly leaders?
  8" flasher = 23" from tip of loop to nose of fly; 11" usually at 28-30"
  
• How do you identify promising areas to fish?
  Look for good temps intersecting bottom and for areas with good depth changes on the chart. Mostly though it is trial and error of just getting out there and taking to others. Fishing the lake is more oriented to the depth of the fish as opposed to a specific location -- especially from Muskegon south on the Michigan coast where you don't have much structure to create upwellings of current.
  
• What is the value of structure in the lake?
  See previous answer
  
• How do you find baitfish?
  Bait orients to temp and structure just like salmon/trout. The reason that salmon/trout feed on alewife is that their temp preferences are very close. Find bait and you will find predators and vise versa.
  
• Is live bait worth giving a shot?
  Off piers I know guys that use live alewife. Never heard of it for trolling. But, cut bait or whole alewife/herring rigs are very effective.
  
• Any other advice you can give?
  Get out and try. Go with others with experience or on a "learning" charter to see how it is done. Ask at the launches/marinas -- peoplee generally love to share and help others (plus brag a little )
  

Some of my earliest "Great Lakes" fishing memories were of catching perch out of AuGres back in the early '70s. First trip, Dad and I didn't have an anchor so we stole a limestone bolder of about 12# off the breakwall and rigged is up to some rope we did have. Worked great and caught our limit of yellow bellies!

I know that both perch and walleye fishing improves over on Erie as the water cools into the fall. Does the same thing happen on the Bay? Would love to make a trip up that way and catch both types of good eating fish

Thanks for the report. Hopefully headed to Holland or Muskegon on Monday if my crew can get their act together... may go solo if I have to

For that time of year I would look to head over to Huron or Vermillion area. Lots of the charters over there are setup for trolling as the fishery is usually out in 40' FOW +.

Here is one I have heard good things about that runs a top notch boat: http://www.walleyecentral.com/Just-Lookn/

Here is a link to the Huron Ohio city marina site that lists others: http://www.cityofhuron.org/huron/parks-and-recreation-marina.html

Here are a couple based in Vermilion Ohio:

http://www.luckydcharters.com/captain.html

http://eriecaptain.com/

As for drinking, most captains will allow it in moderation but being drunk out on the Great Lakes -- even on a charter -- isn't a great idea. I would save that for the after party on land.

Crossed it off my bucket list before I ever had one back in '97 a week after the record laker was caught. Six of us went and we got a couple in the mid to high twenties including my personal best 21#'r. So much fun watching 5 to 10 fish chase a bait from 40' down and too often not get them to take the lure.

Alma, you say? Pizza Sam's, YUM!

Have eaten many a pizza from Sam's growing up! I also remember a Pizza King place that was very good... 30 years ago or so

I'd get to Ludington early and go out on the North pier. Glow casting spoons would be my choice.

I asked the operator of the UGLOS buoys (St. Joe, Holland, Ludington, Traverse City) about the wave height measurements values earlier this summer. He replied with this information:

First of all NOAA reports wave height as the distance from trough to crest (e.g. total height).

NOAA typically reports the "Significant Wave Height", which is the average of the highest 1/3 of all waves. So for every 9 waves, NOAA takes the largest 3 wave heights and averages them. There will always be waves larger and smaller than the significant wave height. The measurement is meant to be "conservative" meaning that it is reporting a value higher than the average of all waves since in bad weather its really the ocassional large waves that are the problem. Also, the NOAA buoys in the middle of the lake (e.g. 45007) are very large buoys and do not measure small wave heights (with small periods) very well and only report readings once per hour. The smaller buoys closer to shore (e.g. 45024 (Ludington) and 45026 (St. Joesph)) are smaller buoys and can measure smaller wave heights better and report wave heights every 10 minutes.

Hope that helps! Looking at the historical data from the buoy for this morning (http://uglos.engin.umich.edu/show_pic.php?station=45029&meas=WVHGT&uom=E&time_diff=-4&time_label=EDT), it looks like there were plenty of 2.5 to 3' waves out there as the norm which means there were plenty of 3 to 4'er too. I don't think the wind switched from the NNE/NE to E nearly as fast as NOAA said it would.

Thanks Nick. I see you live in St. Louis. Grew up there -- north of town on the river (Riverside Drive) but went to Alma for high school as my dad taught and coached there. Drove by on US27 yesterday -- towed a travel trailer north to Farwell for a friend. All of the windmills south of town along the highway are quite the site.

Looks like you have a pretty nice boat in your avatar. When I was growing up there, seemed like I was about the only one who went salmon fishing. I'm guessing you get quite a few weird looks towing it around town there as I do down here.

Hey buddy nice to see you posting over here. If you fished the Croton to Newaygo area in the 70's we probably fished next to each other back then. My friends and I made our living off the DNR when they were buying eggs. I pulled a lot of 30 to 40lb kings out of that stretch esp the Thronapple launch area and right below the dam. I still fish that area for Steelhead all winter when I can get up there.

In college me and a couple of buddies would pay for fishing trips by selling the eggs to the DNR at the trailer on the north side of the dam. Funded food and gas for runs over from Mt. Pleasant (CMU) in '81 to '84. Actually scheduled fall semester classes to have mostly morning classes with none on Thursday afternoon and all of Friday open. If we could get a nice fresh run fish, also made for some good eating of smoked salmon back at the dorm. Yes, many people thought we really nuts.

As you can see from my GLF user profile, I've been a member since 2006 but have spent most of my time lurking and not posting. I spent most of my Internet fishing time over at the Great Lakes Angler magazine size helping out my good buddy Dave Mull as the forum admin on that site. But that site decided that my association with Dave warranted me being demoted to general user with his dearture. That's okay and I'll probably still make some posts there, but I'll be spending a lot more time here at GLF and making more contributions.

I started fishing the Great Lakes at 11 years old in 1970 when Dad bought a small outboard boat that was really more suited for our 1 acre farm pond that it was on Muskegon Lake where we went to try to catch some of the fall run Chinook salmon. Went out jigging off the mouth of the river near the power plant and hooked one. Unfortunately the 12# mono on the Mitchell 300 reel and 6 1/2' Garcia Conolon rod was no match for the 30# King that was on for about 30 seconds including a 3' jump about 30' off the side of the boat just before it broke off steeling my spoon. About two weeks later with some upgraded tackle, we took the boat up to the High Rollways landing upstream on the Muskegon and caught our limit of Kings casting copper Marathon spoons. Did that two more times that fall including some wading just downstream from Croton Dam catching them on spoons while the crazies around us used Newaygo nuggets and Croton crawlers to snag them with pool cues with reels. Dad had no idea what he had done and I was hooked for life to try to catch these big fish. Just a little different than catching bass and bluegill on the pond.

Over the years we got twofootitis a lot and cured it with an upgrade in boats. From the 11' plastic SportYak "pond" boat to a 15' fiberglass Larson dual console tri-hull which we outfitted with a pair of fancy Riviera 300 downriggers from Armstrong's in Whitehall. Then a 16' aluminum Lone Star which we added a pair of big long arm Riviera 700 rigger to, and then a 20' aluminum cuddy IO with leaking rivets that we never got on the water which was replaced by then a 18' Alumacraft center console with twin 55 hp Chrysler outboards my freshman year of college. A couple years later we bought a 1968 20' Bertram cuddy IO that was what I would really call our first "real salmon boat" and upgraded to electric Invader downriggers. Six years later we went "big" with a 24' Chaparall cuddy.

The Chaparall was not a well made boat and two years later got a very cool 22' Cruisers SeaDevil walkaround cuddy with an OMC SeaDrive. Really outfitted it with new Big Jon Captain Pack riggers, a huge Humminbird CVR50 video fish finder and LORAN-C. While the SeaDrive and closed full transom was great, it was a gas guzzler and most marinas didn't want to work on it so that too was expensive and time consuming when we had mechanical issues. In 1997 I got a job at the Palisades Nuc plant near South Haven and found a condo in St. Joe with a boat slip out the back door. Moved the boat from a slip at Crosswinds in Ludington to St. Joe for daily use and 2 years later decided with all the solo fishing I was now able to do, a twin engine center console boat would be a better fit. Sold the SeaDevil and found my current 21' SeaCat power catamaran. Wow was that a lot of boats to let me/us catch salmon more effectively . Interesting that this is actually my second "cat" hull... that first 11' SportYak was also a tunnel "cat" hull boat.

Being a computer analyst specializing in networks and servers, I'm also a computer geek and this carries over to my salmon fishing too. My boat is outfitted with almost any and all of the electronic gizzmos to help find and catch the fish. Mostly a Raymarine setup with 3 displays (helm, stern, and bow) that can show sonar graph, GPS chart, radar, and autopilot. Standard Horizon VHF and chart plotter w/ C-Map charts. Two Vector riggers and two Big Jon Brutes with a FishHawk X4. More electronics per square foot that any boat on the Great Lakes

Now I'm back in the Lansing area (DeWitt) and the boat gets trailered in all directions to follow the hot fishing. St. Joe for spring Coho and Kings, Sterling State Park and Saginaw Bay for walleye and then Holland, Muskegon, Whitehall, Ludinton, Manistee, or Frankfort all summer through fall for salmon. The worst thing about DeWitt is that it is 2 hours to get to a Great Lake for fishing. The best thing about DeWitt is that it is 2 hours to get to Lake Michigan or Lake Erie or Lake Huron/Sag Bay to go fishing!

Have spent lots of hours on the big lakes -- probably averaged running from Lansing to Ludington 2 out of every 3 weekends with the dock at Crosswinds and then averaged fishing 4 days a week out of St. Joe with the condo. Not nearly as much the last few years between new jobs, gas prices, weather and being 2+ hours away... but this year have managed 10 trips of 1 to 3 days to Lake Michigan from Holland north to Ludington.

I see lots of member names here at GLF that I recognize from GLA and other sites too. I hope I can join my buddy Dave here at GLF with some good contributions. My SeaCat (the CATtitude Adjustment) does not have the name on the side yet, but is one of only 3 SeaCat's I know of in the state. If you see me at a ramp, flag me down and say high. I'm always ready to share what I know to help others with Great Lakes Fishing.

With winds switching to the E overnight, it looks like it's going to be pretty good 10 miles and in. Planning on a day trip to Muskegon for Sunday -- hopefully the forecast is right.

Been running it a lot more this year. Usually at least on one rigger and a wire diver. Even sabiki'd some Alewife off the pier at Holland in July and brined it up. The whole Alewife in Big Weenie heads has done as well as the herring strips. Probably 30% of the fish with at most 1/3 of the rods with it on.

Owner posted on another forum that there were some problems with the electronics and he hoped to have it back up shortly.

I have had a RayMarine ST6001 on my 21' dual outboard SeaCat since 2001. Works great. I would check into the newer SmartPilot X-10 with the ST70 Controller. The autopilot is similar to what I have but adds programmable course patterns such as circles, spirals, cloverleaf, figure 8, lazy-S, zigzag, box, box pattern search, and 180 or 360 degree turns. There were rumors that RayMarine was going to bring this out when I got mine but I couldn't wait. Would love to upgrade! I often think that I catch more fish trolling without the autopilot since I don't wander like a human steering does.

Ryan

Boat: 21' SeaCat center console -- CATtitude Adjustment

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